Necromancer curse fear

[Rizos 1487]

2 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

There is no proof that it's a bug. Until valid proof is presented, strictly by definition it's a nerf, not a bug.

You know by urself Destro fear is broken. Every possible fear in game is mental attack but destro skil which was added during 1.5 implementation when tests/proofs from official didnt exist. Look how many 3rd class skills were bugged after 1.5. Dont tell me u believe destro fear is exception. U are one of these reasonable guys in dev8, please dont make clown of urself

[SemenArsonist 568]

Just now, Rizos said:

You know by urself Destro fear is broken. Every possible fear in game is mental attack but destro skil which was added during 1.5 implementation when tests/proofs from official didnt exist. Look how many 3rd class skills were bugged after 1.5. Dont tell me u believe destro fear is exception. U are one of these reasonable guys in dev8, please dont make clown of urself

I believe that there are a million broken things in this game at the moment and destroyer fear doesn't warrant an immediate nerf for any reason at all.

In fact, this nerf would make the game even more broken as it would make titans even more useless outside of olympiad. I don't care what modoy says, "titans have their uses" is not an excuse, you yourselves have admitted that if you are using any class other than tyrant as dps in a melee setup you are playing the wrong game. The difference is chaotical.

And yes I will keep using the word nerf until the opposite is proven.

I'm not going to argue whether it's intended or not as I am not crazy enough to try to understand the thinking pattern of a fucking Korean MMO developer. I also don't have to prove anything because I'm not claiming anything is broken.

If admins want to follow official l2 server changes to the letter, they need to have hard proof as to what they are doing is accurate. Or they could accept that everyone at ncsoft is incompetent (and KOREAN) and deviate from their stupid nonsensical guidelines. The thing is that titan nerfs is the last thing this server needs right now. They are just reinforcing the tyrant/mage meta, titan has exactly one use right now and that is olympiad. Yes even on their traditional role in L2, which is raid boss killing, they are outclassed by tyrants right now. 

That is fucking ridiculous. I repeat that this class needs to be buffed, not nerfed. If admins proceed with this shit you are proposing, they are shooting themselves and server balance in general in the foot.

[Rizos 1487]

2 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

I believe that there are a million broken things in this game at the moment and destroyer fear doesn't warrant an immediate nerf for any reason at all.

In fact, this nerf would make the game even more broken as it would make titans even more useless outside of olympiad. I don't care what modoy says, "titans have their uses" is not an excuse, you yourselves have admitted that if you are using any class other than tyrant as dps in a melee setup you are playing the wrong game. The difference is chaotical.

And yes I will keep using the word nerf until the opposite is proven.

I'm not going to argue whether it's intended or not as I am not crazy enough to try to understand the thinking pattern of a fucking Korean MMO developer. I also don't have to prove anything because I'm not claiming anything is broken.

If admins want to follow official l2 server changes to the letter, they need to have hard proof as to what they are doing is accurate. Or they could accept that everyone at ncsoft is incompetent (and KOREAN) and deviate from their stupid nonsensical guidelines. The thing is that titan nerfs is the last thing this server needs right now. They are just reinforcing the tyrant/mage meta, titan has exactly one use right now and that is olympiad. Yes even on their traditional role in L2, which is raid boss killing, they are outclassed by tyrants right now. 

That is fucking ridiculous. I repeat that this class needs to be buffed, not nerfed. If admins proceed with this shit you are proposing, they are shooting themselves and server balance in general in the foot.

Sorry to disappoint you but destro is the most bugged class right now on club :/.

And yes tyrant is top pvp meele class because of bug too

[MoDoy 1769]

5 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

I believe that there are a million broken things in this game at the moment and destroyer fear doesn't warrant an immediate nerf for any reason at all.

you know what? i will just laugh on this sentence, because somehow MoH, which was literally just boost in olympiad (and not even that insane, because unless you had full equip on elder you wouldnt be able to do jack sh1t), it had no impact

on other hand, destroyers fear, not being affected by literally anything except pure debuff resistance, being AOE fear, making it land in outside of pvp and inside of olympiad, no matter if you have epics or not, is ridiculous and actually needs fix, no matter what you say

you wanted to fix MoH so your destro can kill elders in olympiad? no problem, i will claim that spot back for them by nerfing fear on destros so they can beg elders to let them live in olympiad

[SemenArsonist 568]

Just now, Rizos said:

Sorry to disappoint you but destro is the most bugged class right now on club :/.

And yes tyrant is top pvp meele class because of bug too

Everything is bugged on club. I don't mean to shit on the admins/coder. But there are realistic limits to what you can do and what you can't without full official files. 

The selling point of club is good administration combined with good activity and longterm stability(which is mostly due to good administration). The downside is we are trying to emulate official while not having full knowledge of how things work and the result is a mess. How long can this go on for? Maybe it's time to start viewing things on how they should be, not how ncsoft thinks they should be.

[SemenArsonist 568]

4 minutes ago, MoDoy said:

you know what? i will just laugh on this sentence, because somehow MoH, which was literally just boost in olympiad (and not even that insane, because unless you had full equip on elder you wouldnt be able to do jack sh1t), it had no impact

on other hand, destroyers fear, not being affected by literally anything except pure debuff resistance, being AOE fear, making it land in outside of pvp and inside of olympiad, no matter if you have epics or not, is ridiculous and actually needs fix, no matter what you say

you wanted to fix MoH so your destro can kill elders in olympiad? no problem, i will claim that spot back for them by nerfing fear on destros so they can beg elders to let them live in olympiad

Ah so the gloves come off, finally you admit this is personal. Good good. I thought I was talking to a robot with all the passive aggressive attitude and the smiley faces.

 

[MoDoy 1769]

Just now, SemenArsonist said:

Everything is bugged on club. I don't mean to shit on the admins/coder. But there are realistic limits to what you can do and what you can't without full official files. 

The selling point of club is good administration combined with good activity and longterm stability(which is mostly due to good administration). The downside is we are trying to emulate official while not having full knowledge of how things work and the result is a mess. How long can this go on for? Maybe it's time to start viewing things on how they should be, not how ncsoft thinks they should be.

cool, so fixing elders was top kek priority, because they were able to finally kill the unbeatable trio in olympiad known as DAs/destros/necros, giving some fun to people who dont play meta classes to have some fun, but god protect you once you want to touch one of those 3 farmers, thats something unrealistic, it would totally destroy the balance of the game :d

Just now, SemenArsonist said:

Ah so the gloves come off, finally you admit this is personal. Good good. I thought I was talking to a robot with all the passive aggressive attitude and the smiley faces.

this is by no means personal, i was crying about destro fear for much longer than even last patch came in, as you said yourself, destros werent really troublesome or anything for me to feel like searching days for proofs good enough

but then guess what happened, more and more people started to get to 79/80 lvl and destros on those level became just too ridiculous, so here we are, trying to fix them ;)

[Rizos 1487]

2 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

Everything is bugged on club. I don't mean to shit on the admins/coder. But there are realistic limits to what you can do and what you can't without full official files. 

The selling point of club is good administration combined with good activity and longterm stability(which is mostly due to good administration). The downside is we are trying to emulate official while not having full knowledge of how things work and the result is a mess. How long can this go on for? Maybe it's time to start viewing things on how they should be, not how ncsoft thinks they should be.

What dds are there in game, 

Aw, pw, the, he, Sr, pr, wl, gladi, tyrant, destro, sps, sh, sorc, necro, spoil, craft. Which one from the list is as efficient as necro on pvp? I see most of them as efficient as destro without bugged fear or even weaker 

[SemenArsonist 568]

How long are you going to present last week's qq thread about might of heaven as an excuse to nerf destroyer's roar? Last week is last week, I was pretty annoyed with olympiad and I took it out here. In the end it was bugged(along with other high level nukes) and it was fixed. No nerfs, just fixes. In fact, my QQ had nothing to do with the fixes, it was your evidence about nukes that got might of heaven nerfed. Does what I say while enraged have any importance on any level other than a personal one?

[MoDoy 1769]

3 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

How long are you going to present last week's qq thread about might of heaven as an excuse to nerf destroyer's roar? Last week is last week, I was pretty annoyed with olympiad and I took it out here. In the end it was bugged(along with other high level nukes) and it was fixed. No nerfs, just fixes. In fact, my QQ had nothing to do with the fixes, it was your evidence about nukes that got might of heaven nerfed. Does what I say while enraged have any importance on any level other than a personal one?

wait a moment, why you say MoH got fixed, while we try to nerf destroyers roar? we just want to do exactly same thing, and that is

FIX

not nerf, not boost, but fix, get those words right please, we dont want to lower its to value it shouldnt, we just want it to be as it should, resistable by mental, which means that if you have epics on destro, you get advantage, if you have epics against destro, you get advantage, and on top of that, if you have mental shield as self buff, you get even bigger advantage, like it should be

Edited April 26, 2020 by MoDoy

[iOrdinator 71]

 I guess this why drama goes around. Just bring 7-8-9 destros inside cc and who needs hero’s or whatever?

[SemenArsonist 568]

3 minutes ago, Rizos said:

What dds are there in game, 

Aw, pw, the, he, Sr, pr, wl, gladi, tyrant, destro, sps, sh, sorc, necro, spoil, craft. Which one from the list is as efficient as necro on pvp? I see most of them as efficient as destro without bugged fear or even weaker 

This is the wrong way of looking at things. For me, there are tiers of usefulness.

Broken

Tyrant 

Necro(only because of transfer pain, debuffs are very hard to land on puri and most fights on current meta are over by the time puri ends)

Hero nukers

Efficient

Other nukers

PR

Gladiator tier

Gladiator

Meh tier

Hero daggers

Inefficient

Titan

Warlord

rest of archers

non hero daggers

"Lol nice hp dude, can you please do valor now?" tier

Spoiler

Crafter

 

This is my view on things. You don't have to agree with me. Anything on inefficient tier and below needs a buff in my opinion. This is strictly mass pvp wise, I'm not talking about any other aspect of the game.

[SemenArsonist 568]

9 minutes ago, MoDoy said:

wait a moment, why you say MoH got fixed, while we try to nerf destroyers roar? we just want to do exactly same thing, and that is

FIX

not nerf, not boost, but fix, get those words right please, we dont want to lower its to value it shouldnt, we just want it to be as it should, resistable by mental, which means that if you have epics on destro, you get advantage, if you have epics against destro, you get advantage, and on top of that, if you have mental shield as self buff, you get even bigger advantage, like it should be

Don't make me repeat myself, unless you find definitive proof that it is indeed not working as intended, then it's a nerf, not a fix.

[MoDoy 1769]

4 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

This is my view on things. You don't have to agree with me. Anything on inefficient tier and below needs a buff in my opinion. This is strictly mass pvp wise, I'm not talking about any other aspect of the game.

wait, werent summoners in "inefficient" tier as well? so in your opinion they needed buff, they got it, people cried river (you included) about them and they got nerfed (correct, nerfed, not fixed, nerfed) to be again inefficient tier

what changed your opinion? or this wasnt your opinion 1 month ago when summoners discussion was around? ;) or in reality its just broken destro who you think needs "boost" and not actual fix, because you play it?

Edited April 26, 2020 by MoDoy

[SemenArsonist 568]

Just now, MoDoy said:

wait, werent summoners in "inefficient" tier as well? so in your opinion they needed buff, they got it, people cried river (you included) about them and they got nerfed (correct, nerfed, not fixed, nerfed) to be again inefficient tier

what changed your opinion? or this wasnt your opinion 1 month ago when summoners discussion was around? ;) 

Don't put words in my mouth. Summoners have a unique toolkit and have their own purpose which they can fulfill without having roflmao tier nuke damage. A good summoner cp can do insane things on its own, something that no summoner cp has ever done here as far as I'm aware of. It is harder to achieve but if used properly summoners can be insanely good.

[Cyane 230]

already reported here (april 12, zaken reports):  84.35% land rate with a sample of  147 tries

bit its not yet approved nor received reply even :( i hope it gets fixed soon

Edited April 26, 2020 by Cyane

[MoDoy 1769]

3 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

Don't put words in my mouth. Summoners have a unique toolkit and have their own purpose which they can fulfill without having roflmao tier nuke damage. A good summoner cp can do insane things on its own, something that no summoner cp has ever done here as far as I'm aware of. It is harder to achieve but if used properly summoners can be insanely good.

yes, same goes for destroyer party, good destroyer party could be smashing people around, so whats your point? doesnt destro have exactly same "specialized" toolkit he can be used for? so in that case, why he doesnt deserve to be fixed and work how it should? why you dont see summoner parties around? ayyyy, correct, because they are useless and part of "inefficient" tier group

1 minute ago, Cyane said:

already reported here (april 12):  84.35% land rate with a sample of  147 tries

bit its not yet approved nor received reply even :(

cool, at least people know that those things are not as "sudden" as they might think of, just because it was given in front of their eyes now

Edited April 26, 2020 by MoDoy

[SemenArsonist 568]

2 minutes ago, MoDoy said:

yes, same goes for destroyer party, good destroyer party could be smashing people around, so whats your point? doesnt destro have exactly same "specialized" toolkit he can be used for? so in that case, why he doesnt deserve to be fixed and work how it should? why you dont see summoner parties around? ayyyy, correct, because they are useless and part of "inefficient" tier group

The difference is that destroyer is strictly a damage dealer, while summoners have lots of other uses, primarily debuffing. If you convince san0 to add banes to titans then we could have this discussion again.

[MoDoy 1769]

2 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

The difference is that destroyer is strictly a damage dealer, while summoners have lots of other uses, primarily debuffing. If you convince san0 to add banes to titans then we could have this discussion again.

yes, thats what we are talking about, "specialized toolkit"

destroyer can have insane damage output, summoners can bane, one cannot do what other does and neither second can do what first one does, and if you really are going to argue about summoner being damage dealer, i dare you to go and try to log summoner and be damage dealer, you will get very disappointed, because damage from nukes is same as it was before ANY 2.1 update was installed

Edited April 26, 2020 by MoDoy

[SemenArsonist 568]

10 minutes ago, MoDoy said:

yes, thats what we are talking about, "specialized toolkit"

destroyer can have insane damage output, summoners can bane, one cannot do what other does and neither second can do what first one does, and if you really are going to argue about summoner being damage dealer, i dare you to go and try to log summoner and be damage dealer, you will get very disappointed, because damage from nukes is same as it was before ANY 2.1 update was installed

Insane damage output my ass, you need to reach people to do damage and if you are suicidal enough to try to do this in a mass pvp scenario you will land 2 hits at most before they realize that they are being hit and they will run away from you while the other enemies will focus you for rushing like an idiot to the middle of them and you will die.

Summoners can't burst people, that was never the point of the class, they can deliver enough sustained damage that when combined with efficient assisting can be deadly. All of this from a safe distance.  Also I never said they were supposed to be damage dealers, that was also why I didn't include them in my list.

The fact of the matter is that on a mass pvp scenario any melee dps class other than tyrant right now is IRRELEVANT.

Edited April 26, 2020 by SemenArsonist

[Fortuna 112]

1 hour ago, Rizos said:

You know by urself Destro fear is broken. Every possible fear in game is mental attack but destro skil which was added during 1.5 implementation when tests/proofs from official didnt exist. Look how many 3rd class skills were bugged after 1.5. Dont tell me u believe destro fear is exception. U are one of these reasonable guys in dev8, please dont make clown of urself

Thanks 

 

[SemenArsonist 568]

Just now, Fortuna said:

Thanks 

 

fuck you asshole, stop leaking info

[MoDoy 1769]

1 minute ago, SemenArsonist said:

Insane damage output my ass, you need to reach people to do damage and if you are suicidal enough to try to do this in a mass pvp scenario you will land 2 hits at most before they realize that they are being hit and they will run away from you while the other enemies will focus you for rushing like an idiot to the middle of them and you will die.

Summoners can't burst people, that was never the point of the class, they can deliver enough sustained damage that when combined with efficient assisting can be deadly. Also I never said they were supposed to be damage dealers, that was also why I didn't include them in my list.

The fact of the matter is that on a mass pvp scenario any melee dps class other than tyrant right now is IRRELEVANT.

go play summoner party and show me how your assist can be "deadly", i am really looking forward to it

also maybe if you dont rush like idiot first second of pvp into zerg of enemies, you could be relevant in mass pvp even as destro, idk, what about smashing those enemy bards/tanks who rush first second to aggro your people? yep, correct, stacked destro will still evaporado them, what about compensating a bit of output damage by using guts+zealot? that way you need to worry only about mages and i want to see that sick dps of mages if you have paladin buff+evasion talisman. fyi we lost couple of fights for zaken only because of china destros on limits, not because of some lolo mages/tyrants, sure if there is 1 destro out of 50 people which you know deals lots of damage, its easy to focus, same as me and rizos were focused on daggers back in the time, but put 4-5 of them and suddenly when damage splits between all of them, they wont disappear in 1 second

thing that you cannot play it in mass pvp so its relevant doesnt mean that class is irrelevant, is it worse than tyrant? probably yes, but that doesnt make it instantly useless, huh?

[SemenArsonist 568]

1 minute ago, MoDoy said:

go play summoner party and show me how your assist can be "deadly", i am really looking forward to it

also maybe if you dont rush like idiot first second of pvp into zerg of enemies, you could be relevant in mass pvp even as destro, idk, what about smashing those enemy bards/tanks who rush first second to aggro your people? yep, correct, stacked destro will still evaporado them, what about compensating a bit of output damage by using guts+zealot? that way you need to worry only about mages and i want to see that sick dps of mages if you have paladin buff+evasion talisman. fyi we lost couple of fights for zaken only because of china destros on limits, not because of some lolo mages/tyrants, sure if there is 1 destro out of 50 people which you know deals lots of damage, its easy to focus, same as me and rizos were focused on daggers back in the time, but put 4-5 of them and suddenly when damage splits between all of them, they wont disappear in 1 second

thing that you cannot play it in mass pvp so its relevant doesnt mean that class is irrelevant, is it worse than tyrant? probably yes, but that doesnt make it instantly useless, huh?

I don't even know what you are trying to prove anymore, I think you are arguing just for the heck of it. I've stated my opinion, I've explained my reasoning, what happens from now on is up to the admins. 

[MoDoy 1769]

3 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

I don't even know what you are trying to prove anymore, I think you are arguing just for the heck of it. I've stated my opinion, I've explained my reasoning, what happens from now on is up to the admins. 

this, idk what you are trying to prove as well, but no way you can prove to people that "destro is useless so please, dont fix it", i will find as many proofs as needed for admins to fix this skill, destro will still find its use, both in olympiad and outside of olympiad, unlike many other classes which cannot do either of those, so i see 0 reasons why not to fix this class

so pretty much people just enjoy this class until the day it gets fixed, then if you think, you can just reroll to tyrants to get smashed by other classes for whatever i care, that just shows the lack of imagination from your side

ps: if you think this fear fix is going to be the last nail to destroyer coffin, i have bad news for you, because there are other already proven bugged things on destro which will affect him much more than this fear

Edited April 26, 2020 by MoDoy