horror vs mental shield

BlackJack · January 23, 2017

People wanted Fatal counter to be nerfed since it is so strong on official. Then it stayed that way for months until people cried to fix it like official. So now they see how strong it really is again. In my honest opinion we should strive to be as close to retail as we can get, people get turned off with "custom balancing" even if it is for better or worse. If it was up to me summoners wouldn't have buff pets, those things are really op for any mage/archer group.
TL;DR stay as close to official as we can, then we can complain @ ncsoft like everyone else.
to BlackJack, last time i checked u had castle CP bonus, but if u dont want to count that, lets see, u still would have like 4-5k cp+hp pool on necro, so for that PR needs to generate 9-10k dmg, for that he needs to be at very low HP (lets say 700 HP), and that leaves him with like 1900 HP+CP pool, and i am pretty sure necro can do that dmg in 2 shots (or even 1 shot with crit, which is not rarity at all)
First of all necro has 2400 base hp with BOTB 3200. not 4-5k. Second of all are you seriously trying to make the point that the game should be balanced around having castle CP? If you are , I am done, since you a complete hypocrite and last but not least in importance necro is the tankiest caster. What about others? Also why don't you stick to a point instead of derailing anything im trying to say in another direction so it better fits the point you are trying to argue.
i gave u example of not having castle CP bonus, also i said 4-5k CP+HP pool, which by your counting 1271 CP + 3200 HP = 4471 HP+CP pool, so i was correct
its funny that u try to avoid using necro as example because its tankiest, then lets use also another archer and dmg it makes, or? FC is op in solo gangs, not in mass pvps or biggers cale pvp (even in 18vs18 its not so good anymore)

Nope , you are using necro as an example because its the only caster that can survive a 5k FC. Get real. Keep derailing the topic please.

Oh and btw according to this thread:

https://4gameforum.com/threads/558860/

and the hotfix here

https://4gameforum.com/threads/558590/#post-8169848

The base land rate should be 90% w/o MS , after the hotfixc that was applied there and was applied here today. The land rate with mental shield should be 40% and currently its 20%. The land rate w/o MS atm is under 50%.

So at the moment it's:

40-50% w/o MS base land rate

20-25% with MS

The way it should work is

90% base land rate

40% with MS lvl 4.

What the hotfix is convert the mental shield to an additive bonus instead of multiplicative.

P.S Modoy get a clue.

BlackJack · January 23, 2017

People wanted Fatal counter to be nerfed since it is so strong on official. Then it stayed that way for months until people cried to fix it like official. So now they see how strong it really is again. In my honest opinion we should strive to be as close to retail as we can get, people get turned off with "custom balancing" even if it is for better or worse. If it was up to me summoners wouldn't have buff pets, those things are really op for any mage/archer group.
TL;DR stay as close to official as we can, then we can complain @ ncsoft like everyone else.
to BlackJack, last time i checked u had castle CP bonus, but if u dont want to count that, lets see, u still would have like 4-5k cp+hp pool on necro, so for that PR needs to generate 9-10k dmg, for that he needs to be at very low HP (lets say 700 HP), and that leaves him with like 1900 HP+CP pool, and i am pretty sure necro can do that dmg in 2 shots (or even 1 shot with crit, which is not rarity at all)
First of all necro has 2400 base hp with BOTB 3200. not 4-5k. Second of all are you seriously trying to make the point that the game should be balanced around having castle CP? If you are , I am done, since you a complete hypocrite and last but not least in importance necro is the tankiest caster. What about others? Also why don't you stick to a point instead of derailing anything im trying to say in another direction so it better fits the point you are trying to argue.
i gave u example of not having castle CP bonus, also i said 4-5k CP+HP pool, which by your counting 1271 CP + 3200 HP = 4471 HP+CP pool, so i was correct
its funny that u try to avoid using necro as example because its tankiest, then lets use also another archer and dmg it makes, or? FC is op in solo gangs, not in mass pvps or biggers cale pvp (even in 18vs18 its not so good anymore)
Nope , you are using necro as an example because its the only caster that can survive a 5k FC. Get real. Keep derailing the topic please.
Oh and btw according to this thread:
https://4gameforum.com/threads/558860/
and the hotfix here
https://4gameforum.com/threads/558590/#post-8169848
The base land rate should be 90% w/o MS , after the hotfixc that was applied there and was applied here today. The land rate with mental shield should be 40% and currently its 20%. The land rate w/o MS atm is under 50%.
So at the moment it's:
40-50% w/o MS base land rate
20-25% with MS
The way it should work is
90% base land rate
40% with MS lvl 4.
What the hotfix is convert the mental shield to an additive bonus instead of multiplicative.
P.S Modoy get a clue.

Oh i didn't read that the tests were done already on the PTR with the hotfix aplied

https://i.gyazo.com/2f53f2921569b86f9cda62a3b551d3c1.png

THIS IS HOW FEAR SHOULD LAND AFTER THE HOTFIX WE JUST APPLIED. Currently it's 2-3 times worse depending if u have or u dont have MS.

MoDoy · January 23, 2017

to BlackJack, last time i checked u had castle CP bonus, but if u dont want to count that, lets see, u still would have like 4-5k cp+hp pool on necro, so for that PR needs to generate 9-10k dmg, for that he needs to be at very low HP (lets say 700 HP), and that leaves him with like 1900 HP+CP pool, and i am pretty sure necro can do that dmg in 2 shots (or even 1 shot with crit, which is not rarity at all)
First of all necro has 2400 base hp with BOTB 3200. not 4-5k. Second of all are you seriously trying to make the point that the game should be balanced around having castle CP? If you are , I am done, since you a complete hypocrite and last but not least in importance necro is the tankiest caster. What about others? Also why don't you stick to a point instead of derailing anything im trying to say in another direction so it better fits the point you are trying to argue.
i gave u example of not having castle CP bonus, also i said 4-5k CP+HP pool, which by your counting 1271 CP + 3200 HP = 4471 HP+CP pool, so i was correct
its funny that u try to avoid using necro as example because its tankiest, then lets use also another archer and dmg it makes, or? FC is op in solo gangs, not in mass pvps or biggers cale pvp (even in 18vs18 its not so good anymore)
Nope , you are using necro as an example because its the only caster that can survive a 5k FC. Get real. Keep derailing the topic please.
Oh and btw according to this thread:
https://4gameforum.com/threads/558860/
and the hotfix here
https://4gameforum.com/threads/558590/#post-8169848
The base land rate should be 90% w/o MS , after the hotfixc that was applied there and was applied here today. The land rate with mental shield should be 40% and currently its 20%. The land rate w/o MS atm is under 50%.
So at the moment it's:
40-50% w/o MS base land rate
20-25% with MS
The way it should work is
90% base land rate
40% with MS lvl 4.
What the hotfix is convert the mental shield to an additive bonus instead of multiplicative.
P.S Modoy get a clue.

enlight me where in those 2 posts u can see necros fear? because DAs fear has much bigger base land rate than necros

https://4gameforum.com/threads/601448/

here u can see necros fear is 71.5% on 5 lvls lower target, and u want to persuade me necros fear base land rate is 90% on same lvl? pls, go study a bit more, because u are clueless,
once again i am not saying necros fear works right atm, however after how u act i dont feel obligated to help u find proof for it, and will do max effort to prove u wrong everytime

MoDoy · January 23, 2017

so u gonna post that picture of DAs horror land rate and will fully ignore my argument towards why necros fear cannot have more than 70% base land rate?

Rizos · January 23, 2017

Mby he wanna reroll DA

BlackJack · January 23, 2017

Mby he wanna reroll DA

I spoke with sano and i told him either let affected chars ( necros ) since ( OL can class change to w/e they want anyway ) let us class change to w/e we want or ill cry as much as you guys did for fatal counter. Also from now on im not buying COLs, not worth to support this shitty as server where people pretend and cry about sticking to official server only if it suits them. But when stuff like VR is custom changed they completely ignore it because it doensn't affect them as much.

btw modoy i've cleaned my pk's just for u <3

BlackJack · January 23, 2017

so u gonna post that picture of DAs horror land rate and will fully ignore my argument towards why necros fear cannot have more than 70% base land rate?

show me a necro test or a give me necro lvl 40+ on official to test than instead being a child.

Rizos · January 23, 2017

Mby he wanna reroll DA
I spoke with sano and i told him either let affected chars ( necros ) since ( OL can class change to w/e they want anyway ) let us class change to w/e we want or ill cry as much as you guys did for fatal counter. Also from now on im not buying COLs, not worth to support this shitty as server where people pretend and cry about sticking to official server only if it suits them. But when stuff like VR is custom changed they completely ignore it because it doensn't affect them as much.
btw modoy i've cleaned my pk's just for u <3

I wanted to fix vr u can search in my posts, i made even thread bout it to balance reflect - bring back old vr or smth like that. So ur wrong again. Also modoy reported bugs like sleep trick swicth as too low land rate bug while it affect his sr game play into bad way. So i guess ur wrong again

MoDoy · January 23, 2017

Mby he wanna reroll DA
I spoke with sano and i told him either let affected chars ( necros ) since ( OL can class change to w/e they want anyway ) let us class change to w/e we want or ill cry as much as you guys did for fatal counter. Also from now on im not buying COLs, not worth to support this shitty as server where people pretend and cry about sticking to official server only if it suits them. But when stuff like VR is custom changed they completely ignore it because it doensn't affect them as much.
btw modoy i've cleaned my pk's just for u <3

why should he made exception for necromancers? u can cry as much as u want, check how long we cried with hands full of proofs how it works on official, yet it remained same for half year

u said making FC like on offi is unbalanced, yet having necro with 90% fear land rate is balanced for u i guess (because u play that class ofc), laughing after each pvp how u feared/silenced 6 ppl in a row on first try, ok, cool

sh1tty server? because they are trying to change bugged things? i am pretty sure if u come with some normal proof that necros fear should work different, they will try to fix it immediately, not just your assumptions

so u gonna post that picture of DAs horror land rate and will fully ignore my argument towards why necros fear cannot have more than 70% base land rate?
show me a necro test or a give me necro lvl 40+ on official to test than instead being a child.

so u are changing topic again? why dont u try to tell me my proof is wrong? how can u possibly have 70% land rate chance on debuff on character 5 lvls lower than u BUT 90% on character of same lvl? i guess thats your logic, however its pretty illogical for me

PS: good that you cleaned your pks, coz today u cried like little sh1t when u died from destro when u had karm and blamed me i didnt stun him, pathetic

BlackJack · January 23, 2017

Mby he wanna reroll DA
I spoke with sano and i told him either let affected chars ( necros ) since ( OL can class change to w/e they want anyway ) let us class change to w/e we want or ill cry as much as you guys did for fatal counter. Also from now on im not buying COLs, not worth to support this shitty as server where people pretend and cry about sticking to official server only if it suits them. But when stuff like VR is custom changed they completely ignore it because it doensn't affect them as much.
btw modoy i've cleaned my pk's just for u <3
why should he made exception for necromancers? u can cry as much as u want, check how long we cried with hands full of proofs how it works on official, yet it remained same for half year
u said making FC like on offi is unbalanced, yet having necro with 90% fear land rate is balanced for u i guess (because u play that class ofc), laughing after each pvp how u feared/silenced 6 ppl in a row on first try, ok, cool
sh1tty server? because they are trying to change bugged things? i am pretty sure if u come with some normal proof that necros fear should work different, they will try to fix it immediately, not just your assumptions
so u gonna post that picture of DAs horror land rate and will fully ignore my argument towards why necros fear cannot have more than 70% base land rate?
show me a necro test or a give me necro lvl 40+ on official to test than instead being a child.
so u are changing topic again? why dont u try to tell me my proof is wrong? how can u possibly have 70% land rate chance on debuff on character 5 lvls lower than u BUT 90% on character of same lvl? i guess thats your logic, however its pretty illogical for me

PS: good that you cleaned your pks, coz today u cried like little sh1t when u died from destro when u had karm and blamed me i didnt stun him, pathetic

Lier lier pants on fire. You are lying about 90% fear land rate , cuze we perosnaly tested it with each other and it was 50% on same levels with MS. Sano said necro fear is 50% base land rate according to him. But that wasn't the case before , so he is either lying about only touching mental shield , or mental mental shield had absolutely no effect before OR BOTH.

The second part is incomprehensible , sorry I can't respond.

P.S I never ever said modoy stun him or blamed you for my death LOL. MEGA LYING AGAIN LMAO. Please ask tomorrow on teamspeak if i specifically asked or cried for you to stun that claneless destro that was trying to -4% me. But if you are wrong shut up forever.

BlackJack · January 23, 2017

Mby he wanna reroll DA
I spoke with sano and i told him either let affected chars ( necros ) since ( OL can class change to w/e they want anyway ) let us class change to w/e we want or ill cry as much as you guys did for fatal counter. Also from now on im not buying COLs, not worth to support this shitty as server where people pretend and cry about sticking to official server only if it suits them. But when stuff like VR is custom changed they completely ignore it because it doensn't affect them as much.
btw modoy i've cleaned my pk's just for u <3
I wanted to fix vr u can search in my posts, i made even thread bout it to balance reflect - bring back old vr or smth like that. So ur wrong again. Also modoy reported bugs like sleep trick swicth as too low land rate bug while it affect his sr game play into bad way. So i guess ur wrong again

It wasn't targeted towards you , since i don't remember and haven't researched your position on VR. It was general statement about how people cry for sticking to offical only if it benefits them, since everyone is biased towards the class they play( yes including myself)

Rizos · January 23, 2017

Mental shield didnt affect necro fear before. Simple answer. And im like 95% sure it should be 70% w/o mental right now and with mental - just guess based on how it works vs other debufs- around 35-40%. But for sure not 90% not even 74 necro into lvl 1 char.

Dancerok · January 23, 2017

I more wonder about recent changes MS, According from topic information now Sleep has 20% land rate with MS and fear also about 30% with MS.. Wha about root ???

BlackJack · January 23, 2017

Mental shield didnt affect necro fear before. Simple answer.

It's not that simple sadly. Because before the patch on targets without mental shield necro fear had more than 50% land rate. So it doesn't add up. The most logical answer would be that the hotfix also changed the base chance of fear.

Also modoy said it was 90% chance w/o MS before. Are you calling modoy a lier ? :DD

MoDoy · January 23, 2017

i never said it has 90% land rate, i asked u if 90% land rate on necros fear would be balanced for you, yet YOU said yourself it should be 90%, and i explained u why it cannot be 90%

The base land rate should be 90% w/o MS , after the hotfixc that was applied there and was applied here today. The land rate with mental shield should be 40% and currently its 20%. The land rate w/o MS atm is under 50%.
So at the moment it's:
40-50% w/o MS base land rate
20-25% with MS
The way it should work is
90% base land rate
40% with MS lvl 4.
What the hotfix is convert the mental shield to an additive bonus instead of multiplicative.
P.S Modoy get a clue.

by testing u mean those 6 fears u made to me on karik bridge? yes, it was 50/50, yet next day TheLord pmed me he teste necros fear even when he had core lvl 3, and he said he landed 8/10, which isnt even close to be proper test, unless u make like 30 repetitions, its not even worth to make any conclusions

no comment to dodging second part of it, i wanted u to explain me up to what u based your "this way it should work, 90% base land rate" when on lower lvl character it has 70% chance, but w/e

Mby he wanna reroll DA
I spoke with sano and i told him either let affected chars ( necros ) since ( OL can class change to w/e they want anyway ) let us class change to w/e we want or ill cry as much as you guys did for fatal counter. Also from now on im not buying COLs, not worth to support this shitty as server where people pretend and cry about sticking to official server only if it suits them. But when stuff like VR is custom changed they completely ignore it because it doensn't affect them as much.
btw modoy i've cleaned my pk's just for u <3
I wanted to fix vr u can search in my posts, i made even thread bout it to balance reflect - bring back old vr or smth like that. So ur wrong again. Also modoy reported bugs like sleep trick swicth as too low land rate bug while it affect his sr game play into bad way. So i guess ur wrong again
It wasn't targeted towards you , since i don't remember and haven't researched your position on VR. It was general statement about how people cry for sticking to offical only if it benefits them, since everyone is biased towards the class they play( yes including myself)

pls, show me topic where i was biased on SR gameplay? coz i dont remember anything, if something, i was changing other classes which were BUGGED, sorry for reporting something which doesnt work correctly, as i said, any1 who feels like SR is not working correctly come report it, i will gladly take the nerf (or boost?)

too bad i didnt record that frapses with TS sound of that fight with destro, at least it would show real liar in the topic

Rizos · January 23, 2017

No i just agree with his sentence like this:

so u are changing topic again? why dont u try to tell me my proof is wrong? how can u possibly have 70% land rate chance on debuff on character 5 lvls lower than u BUT 90% on character of same lvl? i guess thats your logic, however its pretty illogical for me

Cant understand why ppl would have lower chance to land debufs on lower lvl enemies.

BlackJack · January 23, 2017

i never said it has 90% land rate, i asked u if 90% land rate on necros fear would be balanced for you, yet YOU said yourself it should be 90%, and i explained u why it cannot be 90%
The base land rate should be 90% w/o MS , after the hotfixc that was applied there and was applied here today. The land rate with mental shield should be 40% and currently its 20%. The land rate w/o MS atm is under 50%.
So at the moment it's:
40-50% w/o MS base land rate
20-25% with MS
The way it should work is
90% base land rate
40% with MS lvl 4.
What the hotfix is convert the mental shield to an additive bonus instead of multiplicative.
P.S Modoy get a clue.

by testing u mean those 6 fears u made to me on karik bridge? yes, it was 50/50, yet next day TheLord pmed me he teste necros fear even when he had core lvl 3, and he said he landed 8/10, which isnt even close to be proper test, unless u make like 30 repetitions, its not even worth to make any conclusions
no comment to dodging second part of it, i wanted u to explain me up to what u based your "this way it should work, 90% base land rate" when on lower lvl character it has 70% chance, but w/e
Mby he wanna reroll DA
I spoke with sano and i told him either let affected chars ( necros ) since ( OL can class change to w/e they want anyway ) let us class change to w/e we want or ill cry as much as you guys did for fatal counter. Also from now on im not buying COLs, not worth to support this shitty as server where people pretend and cry about sticking to official server only if it suits them. But when stuff like VR is custom changed they completely ignore it because it doensn't affect them as much.
btw modoy i've cleaned my pk's just for u <3
I wanted to fix vr u can search in my posts, i made even thread bout it to balance reflect - bring back old vr or smth like that. So ur wrong again. Also modoy reported bugs like sleep trick swicth as too low land rate bug while it affect his sr game play into bad way. So i guess ur wrong again
It wasn't targeted towards you , since i don't remember and haven't researched your position on VR. It was general statement about how people cry for sticking to offical only if it benefits them, since everyone is biased towards the class they play( yes including myself)
pls, show me topic where i was biased on SR gameplay? coz i dont remember anything, if something, i was changing other classes which were BUGGED, sorry for reporting something which doesnt work correctly, as i said, any1 who feels like SR is not working correctly come report it, i will gladly take the nerf (or boost?)
too bad i didnt record that frapses with TS sound of that fight with destro, at least it would show real liar in the topic

Rizos is in the topic and i guess ur both on steamspeak ask hm if i ever blamed u for not stunning that destro ROFL. I got annoyed because i was complaining about my fear not working and you were spamming shit like "rip necro", since your 12 and don't know when to shut up when people aren't in the mood to take a joke.

Edit: also even the bolded part says in general, but you specifically take it personally for no reason?

MoDoy · January 23, 2017

i never said it has 90% land rate, i asked u if 90% land rate on necros fear would be balanced for you, yet YOU said yourself it should be 90%, and i explained u why it cannot be 90%
The base land rate should be 90% w/o MS , after the hotfixc that was applied there and was applied here today. The land rate with mental shield should be 40% and currently its 20%. The land rate w/o MS atm is under 50%.
So at the moment it's:
40-50% w/o MS base land rate
20-25% with MS
The way it should work is
90% base land rate
40% with MS lvl 4.
What the hotfix is convert the mental shield to an additive bonus instead of multiplicative.
P.S Modoy get a clue.

by testing u mean those 6 fears u made to me on karik bridge? yes, it was 50/50, yet next day TheLord pmed me he teste necros fear even when he had core lvl 3, and he said he landed 8/10, which isnt even close to be proper test, unless u make like 30 repetitions, its not even worth to make any conclusions
no comment to dodging second part of it, i wanted u to explain me up to what u based your "this way it should work, 90% base land rate" when on lower lvl character it has 70% chance, but w/e
It wasn't targeted towards you , since i don't remember and haven't researched your position on VR. It was general statement about how people cry for sticking to offical only if it benefits them, since everyone is biased towards the class they play( yes including myself)
pls, show me topic where i was biased on SR gameplay? coz i dont remember anything, if something, i was changing other classes which were BUGGED, sorry for reporting something which doesnt work correctly, as i said, any1 who feels like SR is not working correctly come report it, i will gladly take the nerf (or boost?)
too bad i didnt record that frapses with TS sound of that fight with destro, at least it would show real liar in the topic
Rizos is in the topic and i guess ur both on steamspeak ask hm if i ever blamed u for not stunning that destro ROFL. I got annoyed because i was complaining about my fear not working and you were spamming shit like "rip necro", since your 12 and don't know when to shut up when people aren't in the mood to take a joke.
Edit: also even the bolded part says in general, but you specifically take it personally for no reason?

if it says in general, it also applies to me, u were flaming me how i cried about fixing FC, yet not complaining about VR not working correctly

yes, i consider myself as one of those guys who cried the most about fixing FC, yet i dont see i am playing PR or that i am planning to reroll to it, i am planning to reroll to dagger, yet u saw me reporting they have double the land rate as they should, so dont tell everybody is biased, coz i am actually trying to look objectively on reports

Rizos · January 23, 2017

didnt listen to TS flames so cant confirm anything.

I more wonder about recent changes MS, According from topic information now Sleep has 20% land rate with MS and fear also about 30% with MS.. Wha about root ???

I believe this mental shield is not final version and its going to get further fix because sleep w/o mental is 90% and with mental its 20%, i think it shouldnt be this way, so dont worry about actual numbers just wait for next fix. We didnt test root because it takes a lot of time. Didnt test silence and arrest cos didnt have correct lvl chars. I think sleep and silence and SE root should be 90% w/o mental and 45-55% with mental, arrest dunno base landrate so cant. tell u. OL root should be around 70% w/o mental and around 35-40% with mental

https://4gameforum.com/threads/574496/

Dancerok · January 23, 2017

didnt listen to TS flames so cant confirm anything.
I more wonder about recent changes MS, According from topic information now Sleep has 20% land rate with MS and fear also about 30% with MS.. Wha about root ???
I believe this mental shield is not final version and its going to get further fix because sleep w/o mental is 90% and with mental its 20%, i think it shouldnt be this way, so dont worry about actual numbers just wait for next fix. We didnt test root because it takes a lot of time. Didnt test silence and arrest cos didnt have correct lvl chars. I think sleep and silence and SE root should be 90% w/o mental and 45-55% with mental, arrest dunno base landrate so cant. tell u. OL root should be around 70% w/o mental and around 35-40% with mental
https://4gameforum.com/threads/574496/

Ty Btw Rizos today y give me FC for 5k Now it looks like work 1 shot 1 head! I don't cry just happy for you now pr fc works like offi I guess, at least from Video that i saw from GK about PR there was hit even 10k but it was already 2.0 patch

Rizos · January 23, 2017

Im far away to be stacked like this guy but its fun to watch *_*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoXkpkhmvFU&t

Dancerok · January 23, 2017

Im far away to be stacked like this guy but its fun to watch *_*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoXkpkhmvFU&t

yea but this guy 2.0 and his boost ( on some moment he open his inventory ) very good

Arcanum · January 23, 2017

https://4gameforum.com/threads/601448/

Conclusion : as can be seen from the experimental results, a difference of 10 levels the chance to pass virtually unchanged (or slightly modified).

so basicly the land rate is fixed from lower to same level by the same %.

now i'm curious about how the land rate of debuffs is affecting higher levels. i believe there was a thread with infos somewhere, but haven't found it.

as far as i remember, 2 level difference should mantain the same % of landing debuffs on higher lv targets, but can't remember how it goes on 3/4/5 levels higher.

after 6 i guess that the chances become pretty much the lowest. if we include resist buffs, i guess the chance is non-existant at all.

horror vs mental shield

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