balance sugestions

[darksinger 58]

6 hours ago, Zeperios said:

P.S. oly is not everything. You have to balance the game in and out of oly and sometimes that means 1 is broke and the other isnt.

when I make the post, I give some exemples about buff inside oly and nerfs out of oly.

On 1/13/2022 at 12:14 AM, darksinger said:

Sugestions:

Dance of Meduza

make it dont ignore puri (nerf out of oly)

decreace reuse time (buff inside oly)

for exemple here, if bd get this cd reduction on dance of meduza like this skill is right now, will just be a cancer mass pvp with a lote of para for everywhere.

if it dont ignore puri like now, is no1 care, couse puri is nice.

On 1/13/2022 at 12:14 AM, darksinger said:

what should help:

1 decreace MP consumation of shield strike 

2 debuff resistence from angelic from 40% to 60%

decreace the healling penalty from angelic.

 

Is a rasonable buff, will not change the life of pala out of oly couse is already fine.

here the pala sugestion will change his life inside oly, will be a small change on debuffs, but out of oly have puri so no1 care if u resist 70% or 80%.

----------

the point is a good titan is already able to kill all classes from the game in oly with the actually kit of skills. also this rush make he not  be useless out of oly.

 

to be good on oly a char need: resist debuffs or give hard CC or have burst damage.

destro have the 3 points. other classes dont have even 1 point. for exemple BD.

also I know titan is not perfect even with all this thinks, but is already 1 from the top farm classes in oly, and also good on pve and this rush make he good on pvp.

that is why I dont mention in the list, and also ppl say "wtf buff on titan". everyone knows titan have enough right now comparing with the rest of classes.

[Rizos 1487]

6 hours ago, Zeperios said:

And don't ponies do that in 1 nuke and have long stun and can cast x2 in 20s? Can't necro do that much damage in a few nukes vs 20 seconds of bleed oh and they have 5 82 lvl CC? Don't dwarves have 82 stun that is faster to cast and longer duration and same bleed why are dwarves not OP? No doubt destros have a lot of tools, but you are acting like 1 uppercut and rush means you are dead. 3/4k dmg is not much of CP/HP of well geared high level characters and takes 20 seconds, so many other classes do that much damage in less time, at range, and while you are perma CC. You said 82 uppercut and listed damage still never said an 82 CC that is weaker than uppercut.

 

Have you used uppercut in oly or pvp? 3s stun, 1.8 second animation finish and character is knocked away from you. Everyone acts like skill lasts an eternity and titan has stopped time with this CC. The EFFECTIVE CC time is very low, depending on buffs (in/out oly) is shorter than TK stun.

(Values:       Mana cost,        HP cost,          Range,         skill cast,            animation finish,                skill cooldown)

Have you counted the times in oly where you make uppercut cost mana and go on CD because the cast time is long and LoS'd around a pillar? Your 82 root is .5 second "longer" cast, but robe passive alone makes it shorter. No doubt the skill feels crippling because you are flat on the floor, but of all the hard CC at 82 that was introduced what CC is weaker? Real game balance; CD, mana cost, duration, land rate......his point is uppercut is not anywhere as strong as other 82 CCs that are put in.

Everyone just posts flame instead of making real comparisons and evaluating game. Titan is very strong in oly bc of guts, lionheart, z/f, battle roar, OtB and is warrior class with good damage, but rush with bleed gave them constant damage for people that like to hump and bug pillars and kite for 5 mins because titan doesnt have ranged skills and outside of oly titan is absolutely nothing without rush.

So let's actually evaluate the game as a whole and help the devs for game design rather than just flame whole time. The bleed damage is probably too high, but just complaining without giving real reasons and balance just means devs will not implement your complaint because they have to think of new design, code, test, and test more which is so much time for a complaint for 2 characters on all of server.

P.S. oly is not everything. You have to balance the game in and out of oly and sometimes that means 1 is broke and the other isnt.

kekw. Imagine tank vengence, no other class can do dmg to him, but then destro comes, rush it and cause 4800 dmg in 30s duration of vengence while tank prolly has like 7k hp. Legit right? What other class can cause 5k dmg to tank on ud? Uppercut? you mean skill that can crit for 4k to +9 bw set bishop that has 6k hp? you do upper cut and when it crit on full hp bish, you need just 1 more skil and he is dead. Definitely underpowered skill :D. Is there anything that even helps to resist it? cos for other debufs there is

[Zeperios 18]

4 hours ago, Rizos said:

kekw. Imagine tank vengence, no other class can do dmg to him, but then destro comes, rush it and cause 4800 dmg in 30s duration of vengence while tank prolly has like 7k hp. Legit right? What other class can cause 5k dmg to tank on ud? Uppercut? you mean skill that can crit for 4k to +9 bw set bishop that has 6k hp? you do upper cut and when it crit on full hp bish, you need just 1 more skil and he is dead. Definitely underpowered skill :D. Is there anything that even helps to resist it? cos for other debufs there is

#kappa

https://www.youtube.com/c/EncubeREAL/videos

Top tier streamer but you might not have heard of him. I think he plays a class that bleeds for 105/s vs 134/s and might even activate through walls, LoS, and at range.....??? I heard he might have couple skills that hit for 2k dmg base let a lone crits, hit from LoS by almost like 2nd character, and have short CD. I think he has like some cat friend too that can do almost similar if not more damage. Just to warn you this streamer is best player on the server he plays on though so take it with a grain of salt.

[MoDoy 1772]

5 minutes ago, Zeperios said:

#kappa

https://www.youtube.com/c/EncubeREAL/videos

Top tier streamer but you might not have heard of him. I think he plays a class that bleeds for 105/s vs 134/s and might even activate through walls, LoS, and at range.....??? I heard he might have couple skills that hit for 2k dmg base let a lone crits, hit from LoS by almost like 2nd character, and have short CD. I think he has like some cat friend too that can do almost similar if not more damage. Just to warn you this streamer is best player on the server he plays on though so take it with a grain of salt.

average destroyer will mop floor with average summoner in olympiad

top tier destroyer will have 50/50 chance to win top tier summoner, except in open arena, where top tier destro once again should have upper hand over top tier summoner

bleed on new rush skill gives too much damage. on other hand, bleed of daggers and string/poison of DEs is not dealing enough dmg (wannabe lvl up on 82, both damage and land rate)

[Zeperios 18]

4 minutes ago, MoDoy said:

average destroyer will mop floor with average summoner in olympiad

top tier destroyer will have 50/50 chance to win top tier summoner, except in open arena, where top tier destro once again should have upper hand over top tier summoner

bleed on new rush skill gives too much damage. on other hand, bleed of daggers and string/poison of DEs is not dealing enough dmg (wannabe lvl up on 82, both damage and land rate)

All true. Different points than what are being complained about and I'm discussing besides me saying bleed does do too much dmg before. Just trying to point out other classes / skills / situations that are as bad or worse than what people are complaining about uppercut and rush bleed dmg. Rizos doesn't want to get crit by uppercut for 4k from a character that has to run a yul weapon to keep up with bishop on 2/3 oly maps and a skill that has ~1.2 second cast animation (after haste and zerk) that is cancelled by LoS.

This skill is broken in Super Smash too.

[MoDoy 1772]

2 minutes ago, Zeperios said:

All true. Different points than what are being complained about and I'm discussing besides me saying bleed does do too much dmg before. Just trying to point out other classes / skills / situations that are as bad or worse than what people are complaining about uppercut and rush bleed dmg. Rizos doesn't want to get crit by uppercut for 4k from a character that has to run a yul weapon to keep up with bishop on 2/3 oly maps and a skill that has ~1.2 second cast animation (after haste and zerk) that is cancelled by LoS.

This skill is broken in Super Smash too.

the thing with uppercut is that it has 10% resist chance, no matter how stacked your opponent is or how weak your destro is, 90% chance to land something that he cannot move after for several seconds - that gives you window to use 2 of your other stuns/fear

i heard ppl finally started to resist some of the fears from destros (those who reached lvl 82 and have full epics), but you have to understand if you are lower level than 82 or you are not fully stacked with epics, uppercut can be landed without chance of interruption, because fear has immediate cast and ppl get comboed from 100 to 0 just like that (fear - demolition - armor crush - uppercut - hammer crush), because on top of giving non resistable debuff, it gives crazy damage

[Sensei 460]

Delete the dumb Rush and we're bomba.
Who tf came up with Rush on char that can jump on you and Fear/Stun/Uppercut you.

Edited January 21, 2022 by Sensei

[Zeperios 18]

7 minutes ago, MoDoy said:

the thing with uppercut is that it has 10% resist chance, no matter how stacked your opponent is or how weak your destro is, 90% chance to land something that he cannot move after for several seconds - that gives you window to use 2 of your other stuns/fear

i heard ppl finally started to resist some of the fears from destros (those who reached lvl 82 and have full epics), but you have to understand if you are lower level than 82 or you are not fully stacked with epics, uppercut can be landed without chance of interruption, because fear has immediate cast and ppl get comboed from 100 to 0 just like that (fear - demolition - armor crush - uppercut - hammer crush), because on top of giving non resistable debuff, it gives crazy damage

Well made points, but if you evaluate your statement it seems that uppercut is not what is OP but it is fear. Based on the original comment by Lykra about uppercut it is understood that fear is being resisted now on lvl 82 targets (they dont need epics to resist). The 82 lvl CC that titans get can be interrupted by LoS and played around because it is slow which is the initial argument. So while titans push to 81/82 they get a new CC but if they fight targets at similar level to them they are actually getting less effective.

 

On 1/13/2022 at 10:14 AM, Lykra said:

Destro needs a reliable CC (good luck landing 78 skills on 82+) or tweak to Uppercut. Feels so bad to use.

[Zeperios 18]

18 hours ago, darksinger said:

other classes dont have even 1 point. for exemple BD.

Instead of looking for medusa change, what if admins reworked a bit of the DE and specfically BD skills. I think everyone can pretty much agree that dance of protection is almost a completely useless skill. What if protection kept (or not) reflect dmg reduction and added some debuff resistance. Plays into the skill name a bit and somewhat the idea behind the dance. This comes with large mass PvP implications bc if it is too strong then you will be required to dance it, and since dance slots are limited caster parties are buffed because they use less disco then melee. Or even better adding it to defense motion. But protection dance can get reworked as it is a pretty much a useless skill.

Next, BD as a melee dmg dealer is a joke in late stages of L2. They are meant to be a bard and provide extra dmg to other classes, everyone knows this and Sano echoed it recently in your posts. Great should not be a large base dmg dealer themselves, OK. This also means that their dances are not that useful in olympiad because their stats are no where competitive to other classes and gear doesnt scale as well on them. What BD's do have is amazing caster dances and those scale very well with gear and base stats. So, what if DE casts were scaled so that DE's could more effectively use these skills in oly.

Freezing strike now -  slows, pretty long cast time, not much dmg

Freezing strike change idea - keep slow, more dmg or scale with BD dances, lower cast time???? The skill cant be too strong or else BD's will be like another caster in a caster party. They may run out of MP in mass pvp so maybe that is the balance, but freezing strike can get a buff to help BD be more of a caster type debuffer in oly.

Poison blade dance -  hard skill to tune besides another level of it since it is melee but it is a decent skill. If possible going through medusa could be a cool/interesting buff.

Poison and/or Sting - I think 1 of these needs to be redone for 82. Probably makes more sense to do poison bc its castable, but might make SK significantly stronger. Don't flame me Rizos I know you want bleed and sting at 82. THESE COULD BE GREAT THINGS FOR PLAYERS TO TEST ON THE TEST SERVER FOR FUTURE PATCHES ADMINS!!!!!!

Last: Drain HP - so many other classes have base heals in oly which is amplified by runes (iss and/or aeore). The other differences between the other classes is that heals are typically done LoS and obviously self cast, so the player healing is safe. All DE's have is slow cast, fairly low dmg, small leach cast. This is another nuke that could be scaled with BD dances to make them relevant as a dmg dealer and give some sustain. I think this could be a fairly "easy" implemented and balance change. It is easy to estimate how much healing other classes can do in a given time with given MP. Use those values to balance a health differential on DE's offensive skill. You do XX dmg to the opponent (dmg to opponent is not as valuable as self healing) and you need to return XX health on yourself for characters in equivalent gear.

The DE archetype is supposed to be more offensive and damage focused which is great, but that doesnt mean in a private server where balances are done to help improve game stability that the archetype cant evolve over time to still be offensive but have some utility with it.

@darksinger Let me know what think of some of these ideas and how do you think BD could end up doing in oly with some of these changes?

[Rizos 1487]

1 hour ago, Zeperios said:

 

Poison and/or Sting - I think 1 of these needs to be redone for 82. Probably makes more sense to do poison bc its castable, but might make SK significantly stronger. Don't flame me Rizos I know you want bleed and sting at 82. THESE COULD BE GREAT THINGS FOR PLAYERS TO TEST ON THE TEST SERVER FOR FUTURE PATCHES ADMINS!!!!!!

 

tbh i would be more than happy if dark elves get new lvl of poison on 82, with some reasonably boosted dmg per tick ^^

Edited January 21, 2022 by Rizos

[darksinger 58]

On 1/21/2022 at 5:37 PM, Zeperios said:

@darksinger Let me know what think of some of these ideas and how do you think BD could end up doing in oly with some of these changes?

the point from all this thinks is, even after get full buffs on all other skills, if bd dont have meduza to give back the cc on enemy, is 0 change to win. will help a lote, but still dont have changes on actual mechanic for oly.

about this frenzy strike, it can change from mage to fight skill, like on essence. it will make the cast faster and scale with p.atak, what is nice.

[Creative1365 17]

11 hours ago, darksinger said:

the point from all this thinks is, even after get full buffs on all other skills, if bd dont have meduza to give back the cc on enemy, is 0 change to win. will help a lote, but still dont have changes on actual mechanic for oly.

about this frenzy strike, it can change from mage to fight skill, like on essence. it will make the cast faster and scale with p.atak, what is nice.

Pole..you should put some nice robe on you good staff with freoh and drain enemies

[Nez 24]

On 1/23/2022 at 10:40 AM, Creative1365 said:

Pole..you should put some nice robe on you good staff with freoh and drain enemies

i do it with my box BD with traded gear from OL 

Edited January 24, 2022 by Nez

[MoDoy 1772]

DA

increase casting of dark panther to some ridiculous amount, like 45s with casting speed setup and 1 minute if you dont have wit dyes/casting speed set. what is this ridiculous "7s and i summon new pet", he is not summoner and ppl who say he doesnt have heal for pet to keep it alive, he has 3 UDs (which pet gets as well), he has aggro/mass aggro to protect it, once it dies, you should pay the price for losing it

summoners

drastically increase mana consumption for summoning new pet (be it even like 1000 mana)
drastically decrease mana consumption for healing pet (lower it to some ridiculous amount like 30-50)
you shouldnt just ditch the pet like that, healing your pet right now is pointless coz it costs same amount of mp like summoning new one pretty much, that way you promote gameplay which you actually have to play around your summon, not just "go my slave, i dont care what happens, i will go like rat somewhere and wait", when he goes for healing pet, he cannot have wall in between and needs to get exposed
it has slight advantage for summoners as well, because not resummoning it means it keeps pet buffs you give him

Edited January 28, 2022 by MoDoy

[Zeperios 18]

Follow on, pet has UD to keep it alive. Now pet UD is just used to get a few more hits before resummon.

[MoDoy 1772]

2 hours ago, MoDoy said:

DA

increase casting of dark panther to some ridiculous amount, like 45s with casting speed setup and 1 minute if you dont have wit dyes/casting speed set. what is this ridiculous "7s and i summon new pet", he is not summoner and ppl who say he doesnt have heal for pet to keep it alive, he has 3 UDs (which pet gets as well), he has aggro/mass aggro to protect it, once it dies, you should pay the price for losing it

summoners

drastically increase mana consumption for summoning new pet (be it even like 1000 mana)
drastically decrease mana consumption for healing pet (lower it to some ridiculous amount like 30-50)
you shouldnt just ditch the pet like that, healing your pet right now is pointless coz it costs same amount of mp like summoning new one pretty much, that way you promote gameplay which you actually have to play around your summon, not just "go my slave, i dont care what happens, i will go like rat somewhere and wait", when he goes for healing pet, he cannot have wall in between and needs to get exposed
it has slight advantage for summoners as well, because not resummoning it means it keeps pet buffs you give him

ah, and also i forgot, necro is also not summoner, bring back old mechanics where necromancer needs corpse of mob to summon pet, not this mindless resummoning, he is not summoner, he shouldnt have such powerful tool

Edited January 28, 2022 by MoDoy

[darksinger 58]

On 1/28/2022 at 10:10 PM, MoDoy said:

ah, and also i forgot, necro is also not summoner, bring back old mechanics where necromancer needs corpse of mob to summon pet, not this mindless resummoning, he is not summoner, he shouldnt have such powerful tool

agree, with this changes, the oly will not be a 3 classes fiesta, will give place to other classes.

 

On 1/28/2022 at 8:02 PM, MoDoy said:

"7s and i summon new pet",

and u dont see a DA cast fear faster than necro hahaha this casting speed is really crazy.

[Zeperios 18]

This is more of a question and @MoDoy suggestions are way more balancing for the server than this, but is there a way to balance stigma for archers too?

Stigma now helps pretty much every class except archers. I ask it as a question because I think just adding “- bow resistance” will make skills hit too hard vs making archers auto attacks hit for a reasonable amount of damage. It doesn’t seem that archer parties are completely useless in pvp (they just obviously aren’t the best and in a server this old why not just play the best). The crit dmg buff last year gave a boost for sure but I think the major difference is that to run a GOOD pve let alone pvp archer party you need all of the archer types so even in pve it’s a large party to compare to similar dmg from 1 melee.

I think giving a range counter crit would bring back old school archers of getting crit 1 shot and with othell would be too strong, but stigma could be a help or some other way to encourage archer auto attacks which would also help farming.

Last idea to maybe help archers, but would pretty much only affect pvp sadly is; the crit dmg passive give some penetration through crit reduction (CC, COP).

 

Again though, the above suggestions around summoners, necro and DA I think are way more balancing even compared to allowing a revitalized CP configuration. 

[MoDoy 1772]

9 minutes ago, Zeperios said:

This is more of a question and @MoDoy suggestions are way more balancing for the server than this, but is there a way to balance stigma for archers too?

Stigma now helps pretty much every class except archers. I ask it as a question because I think just adding “- bow resistance” will make skills hit too hard vs making archers auto attacks hit for a reasonable amount of damage. It doesn’t seem that archer parties are completely useless in pvp (they just obviously aren’t the best and in a server this old why not just play the best). The crit dmg buff last year gave a boost for sure but I think the major difference is that to run a GOOD pve let alone pvp archer party you need all of the archer types so even in pve it’s a large party to compare to similar dmg from 1 melee.

I think giving a range counter crit would bring back old school archers of getting crit 1 shot and with othell would be too strong, but stigma could be a help or some other way to encourage archer auto attacks which would also help farming.

Last idea to maybe help archers, but would pretty much only affect pvp sadly is; the crit dmg passive give some penetration through crit reduction (CC, COP).

 

Again though, the above suggestions around summoners, necro and DA I think are way more balancing even compared to allowing a revitalized CP configuration. 

from what i understood, you would love to rebalance archers, as its not very appealing archetype for party and even if some party like that exists, its usually full PR because anything else except "fatal" does not really make damage. there are 2 approaches for balancing archers more

1) make archers skill based classes and forget fully about auto attacks - these changes happened in future classic chronicles on official, where double shot/lethal shot got power increase, huge decrease in casting speed and reuse, huge decrease in their MP consumption, increase crit chance on those skills (archers were literally able to spam skills and deal decent amount of damage with it)

here is some idea how gameplay looks like on such archer (ignore the fact there is million changes in UI, just the fact that playstyle is kinda real target, lethal shot, double shot, kite 1s, repeat - that way other archers should be at least slightly competitive with PR setup and not to say that skills damage is not affected by crit dmg reduction buffs, which rekt archers pretty much)

2) fully remove crit reduction buffs (CoP 30%, CC 30%, ??) - before those skills were added, archers were viable party setup (eventho not the most popular), because their aa crits were at least doing something to opponents instead of tickling and they were main force in long term pvps (as mages and melees would run out of mp, thats the moment archers start to swipe everything) - however with addition of all crit reduction buffs, funny thing was that your critical auto attack was doing less dmg to tanks than your normal auto attack  

now with removing those buffs, what you will achieve is far greater balancing than with first solution, because

1. old school aa archer archetype will be saved (needs to be tested, thats just my idea it should normalize dmg a bit)
2. by removing those buffs, parties wouldnt have to box buffers just to get that extra 1-2 buffs (mage parties WC for CoP and spirit, all parties PP for CC and bts), which is annoying
3. by removing CC, you get rid of the cancer RB farming, where all melees get 100% crit dmg bonus, so on high lvl bosses, you dont have to stand with several chars and nuke your destros to proc CC on them, on low lvl bosses, RB farmers would farm them slightly slower (tho not sure if they use CC or not, even if, only 1 DD gets the bonus, but i think they farm bosses with 2-3 chars anyway)
4. tyrant, the long term king of pve should lose quite some of his power, dont take me wrong, it will still be strong, but without CC procs on strong mobs like in GC/FI, his farming speed should lower significantly, sometimes should be even problematic in case he aggroes more mobs (right now he doesnt care, he pop zealot, CC triggers and he vamps back and kills mobs in few hits), without CC he should be more careful
5. situation with daggers would normalize as well (lets face it, they are trash) - by removing crit reduction buffs, their overall dmg should increase, however by removing CC, you are getting rid of those crazy "lucky" powerspikes dagger has
   (example:

• 5a) right now, you are dagger, you can hit for 2k [and thats kinda low], if you crit with skill, its 4k, if you have CC proc on, you hit for 8k, which starts to be close to 1 shot mage on full HP if you had slightly better gear
• 5b) if you remove crit reduction buffs, dagger will hit 3k normal hits, if crits, its 6k, but you eliminate the next double damage option with CC trigger on, so you dont get those crazy 10-20k numbers, but your average damage and damage from 1 rotation should increase slightly

 

now, first option is more lazy, require less work and should make archer works, second option requires more testing how things behave, but generally should solve much more balancing than first option

[Zeperios 18]

Personally I never liked the caster archer in L2. Just play a mage.

I agree that first option is the easiest, but IMO probably least satisfying and still leaves archers to be plvl’d by a melee and is a physical mage (aka no healing or vamp). The second option is nice but provides so much barrier to take CC out of the game. That is like a whole year long rebalance just to remove that 1 skill.
 

That is why I gave the comment of providing some “crit penetration”. If bow mastery ignored the crit reduction buffs that would give the effect of removing CC and CoP to them while not having to rebalance everything and balance the physical class that doesn’t benefit much from CC. I think if this is done there would need to be minor rebalance of skills that can crit because a skill should not: crit from range and ignore crit reduction while daggers are in the thick of a fight. So remove crit from double shot, lethal and death sting. Increase powers a bit to compensate for no crits but emphasizes archers trying to get crits from auto attacks to do large dmg.

This would be interesting and fun to play again, but DA, summoner, and necro balance would be better. All of it would be amazing to allow for various CPs in pvp. What a dream right?

[MoDoy 1772]

1 hour ago, Zeperios said:

Personally I never liked the caster archer in L2. Just play a mage.

I agree that first option is the easiest, but IMO probably least satisfying and still leaves archers to be plvl’d by a melee and is a physical mage (aka no healing or vamp). The second option is nice but provides so much barrier to take CC out of the game. That is like a whole year long rebalance just to remove that 1 skill.
 

That is why I gave the comment of providing some “crit penetration”. If bow mastery ignored the crit reduction buffs that would give the effect of removing CC and CoP to them while not having to rebalance everything and balance the physical class that doesn’t benefit much from CC. I think if this is done there would need to be minor rebalance of skills that can crit because a skill should not: crit from range and ignore crit reduction while daggers are in the thick of a fight. So remove crit from double shot, lethal and death sting. Increase powers a bit to compensate for no crits but emphasizes archers trying to get crits from auto attacks to do large dmg.

This would be interesting and fun to play again, but DA, summoner, and necro balance would be better. All of it would be amazing to allow for various CPs in pvp. What a dream right?

the whole idea behind this removing crit reduction buffs is, that from what i was thinking from, it has only positive effects and on classes, which are not that popular to play (daggers/archers/destro and slight negative effect on tyrant, which is also + in this case, as i believe admins were thinking for long time how to slightly nerf tyrants pve)

only bad thing is farming epics like baium/zaken (antharas is farmed with mages anyway i heard), which will take more time, but still should be more than killable

Edited February 2, 2022 by MoDoy

[Creative1365 17]

I think they shouldn't delete the cc 

Better is to make it usefully for archers or how up is described archers should get extra passive or buff for negate these buffs

 

[MoDoy 1772]

6 hours ago, Creative1365 said:

I think they shouldn't delete the cc 

Better is to make it usefully for archers or how up is described archers should get extra passive or buff for negate these buffs

 

question is, why they shouldnt delete CC? why is it better to do something else? would love to see arguments on why its important for that buff to stay

[Creative1365 17]

14 hours ago, MoDoy said:

question is, why they shouldnt delete CC? why is it better to do something else? would love to see arguments on why its important for that buff to stay

They shouldn't do it because in game we have a lot of characters which get good bonuses from it .

Without active cc it increase CRIT DMG def is helpful on supps mage etc .

With active cc a lot of melee get a extra DMG what is really important on lower equipment people or in pvp 

If we want archers hots more we can add some buff in passives or make the cc working also on theirs hits

[MoDoy 1772]

8 hours ago, Creative1365 said:

They shouldn't do it because in game we have a lot of characters which get good bonuses from it .

Without active cc it increase CRIT DMG def is helpful on supps mage etc .

With active cc a lot of melee get a extra DMG what is really important on lower equipment people or in pvp 

If we want archers hots more we can add some buff in passives or make the cc working also on theirs hits

you realize by removing CC and CoP, even if some melee chars get extra DMG from it (only when its triggered), your targets lose the bonus for defense (which is always up)

also by removing CoP and CC - supports lose some overall defense from it, so ppl will hit them harder on average, but you wont be getting those lucky 1 shot crits (or at least fewer of them), which means good playstyle, keeping HPs/CPs filled will be promoted, instead of getting IK no matter what you do

so in general - ppl who profited from triggered CC will now profit on average dmg boost, ppl who profited from non-triggered CC will now profit on not getting ridiculous spike lucky damage

only ppl who could be against removal of CC are PvE ppl, who love to farm bosses with CC triggers (from epics it affects baium and zaken? but at least ppl wont be killing it with 1 destro party right?) or have melee chars (*cough, cough* tyrants *cough*),  which in my opinion (and pretty sure many others have also this opinion) should be nerfed anyway, as its way too strong in PvE compared to any other class