LS

[Dancerok 21]

Rizos can y please creat a topic where y will inculude everything that goes to debuffs ? according to my experience it's almost everything stuns( all kind : Sonic buster, thunder storm, stun shot, hammer crush and so on.)), mental attacks(trick, switch, aura flash, mirrage, silence, fear and so on) holds( dryad root, seal of binding, arrest and so on), sleeps( dreaming spirit, trance,sleeping cloud, sleep and so on ), poisons( not necessery to inculde)))), magical debuffs( mostly OL skills also wind shackle and so on , physical debuffs( like gladis - armor, tribunal, real target ,Excruciating Strike, aggressions( don't need to say about this everybody knows ) , paralyzes ( Anchor, ls ) ?? I Point that it's only my opinion maybe I miss something or totally wrong that's why I want to ask other's opinions 

P.S. Buff cancelation skills doesn't belong to debuffs I guess 

​wanted to do such thing but its a lot of work ;/

Also once i was bored and started to do it but there is not even proper forum section for it. Smth like "Guides" section and "Flames" section is needed

​If y can do it I will appreciate it a lot  =) 

[Dancerok 21]

​Hmm Check this guys 

Song of Purification

1

buff

66

0

23800000

0

-

With 50% probability removes debuffs from party members. Debuff Resistance +80%, Healing Power +30% for 2 min.

 

This is according to the l2central.info, and now according to l2wiki we see 

Song of Purification

Provides an 80% chance of removing a party member's debuffs. And for the next 2 minutes, increases Debuff Resistance by 30% and increases the Healing power received by 30%.

 

So I guess the right one from l2wiki guys and of course 30% not so imba as 80 

​https://l2wiki.com/classic/Song_of_Purification_-_Sword_Muse 

u took info from l2 wiki from gf/h5 update, classic version is 50% to remove debuffs, 80% debuff resistance

​Hmm this guys, what the was thinking about when added so strong debuff resisting skill ..... Even if it's classic it's doesnt mean that 80 unreachable lvl 

​well, if some pt will have this song, u either kite that 2 mins (which isnt that good idea, most of the time its also impossible) or u simply fight with them same way as u would fight atm vs 5 lvls higher pt, annoying, but not impossible to win

​How y will get know that party has this song? besides if they rush on y y can't kite it for sure...

What to do classes that 90% depends from debuffs? Instantly die. At least to do reuse time longer not 2 min song duration and 1 more min reuse time 

[MoDoy 1769]

​Hmm Check this guys 

Song of Purification

1

buff

66

0

23800000

0

-

With 50% probability removes debuffs from party members. Debuff Resistance +80%, Healing Power +30% for 2 min.

 

This is according to the l2central.info, and now according to l2wiki we see 

Song of Purification

Provides an 80% chance of removing a party member's debuffs. And for the next 2 minutes, increases Debuff Resistance by 30% and increases the Healing power received by 30%.

 

So I guess the right one from l2wiki guys and of course 30% not so imba as 80 

​https://l2wiki.com/classic/Song_of_Purification_-_Sword_Muse 

u took info from l2 wiki from gf/h5 update, classic version is 50% to remove debuffs, 80% debuff resistance

​Hmm this guys, what the was thinking about when added so strong debuff resisting skill ..... Even if it's classic it's doesnt mean that 80 unreachable lvl 

​well, if some pt will have this song, u either kite that 2 mins (which isnt that good idea, most of the time its also impossible) or u simply fight with them same way as u would fight atm vs 5 lvls higher pt, annoying, but not impossible to win

​How y will get know that party has this song? besides if they rush on y y can't kite it for sure...

What to do classes that 90% depends from debuffs? Instantly die. At least to do reuse time longer not 2 min song duration and 1 more min reuse time 

​not every song/dance have same animation, so if they s/d on your sight, some member can see them using it and take advantage of it to kite at least some time of it, ofc its not always possible

thats why sometimes diversity for pt is better, not having full burst dmg setup on DDs but some crowd controler as well, also its not good to have whole cp being crowd controlers but have something with good dps, also if your whole cp depends on landing debuffs, then u arent competitive if u arent on same lvl as those high lvl enemies, and then u should have song of purification as well, once they have it

[MoDoy 1769]

​How y will get know that party has this song? besides if they rush on y y can't kite it for sure...

What to do classes that 90% depends from debuffs? Instantly die. At least to do reuse time longer not 2 min song duration and 1 more min reuse time 

​not every song/dance have same animation, so if they s/d on your sight, some member can see them using it and take advantage of it to kite at least some time of it, ofc its not always possible

thats why sometimes diversity for pt is better, not having full burst dmg setup on DDs but some crowd controler as well, also its not good to have whole cp being crowd controlers but have something with good dps, also if your whole cp depends on landing debuffs, then u arent competitive if u arent on same lvl as those high lvl enemies, and then u should have song of purification as well, once they have it

​It's not only about dmg the game is build in the way that some classes depends on debuffs on 90% some on 50 while other dont need it at all, for example archers cp doesnt care about this song they are mostly auto hit while Warlords, Gladis, Destros, Tyrants even Daggers  depends on debuffs ( some 50% some 20%  depends ). I just want to underline that with this buff implementation everyone will start reroll to archer or mages soon...

​sorry, but i want to disagree with your statemenet, on our server archers do depend on debuffs in case of pt vs pt or 18vs18, on mass pvps ofc not, but thats not the point atm i guess, if u cannot stun someone, there is not big chance to burst him down, and on the other hand i believe that tyrant can go straight to u and 2-3 shot u and doesnt give a **** about debuffs at that moment

ofc it depends on situation if u need to use debuffs or not, but saying some classes are not dependant on debuffs is sh1t imo

also from our server, i dont see ppl using debuffs as heavily as on rus/eu off videos, where u can see everyone running with 5 debuffs

[Dancerok 21]

​How y will get know that party has this song? besides if they rush on y y can't kite it for sure...

What to do classes that 90% depends from debuffs? Instantly die. At least to do reuse time longer not 2 min song duration and 1 more min reuse time 

​not every song/dance have same animation, so if they s/d on your sight, some member can see them using it and take advantage of it to kite at least some time of it, ofc its not always possible

thats why sometimes diversity for pt is better, not having full burst dmg setup on DDs but some crowd controler as well, also its not good to have whole cp being crowd controlers but have something with good dps, also if your whole cp depends on landing debuffs, then u arent competitive if u arent on same lvl as those high lvl enemies, and then u should have song of purification as well, once they have it

​It's not only about dmg the game is build in the way that some classes depends on debuffs on 90% some on 50 while other dont need it at all, for example archers cp doesnt care about this song they are mostly auto hit while Warlords, Gladis, Destros, Tyrants even Daggers  depends on debuffs ( some 50% some 20%  depends ). I just want to underline that with this buff implementation everyone will start reroll to archer or mages soon...

​sorry, but i want to disagree with your statemenet, on our server archers do depend on debuffs in case of pt vs pt or 18vs18, on mass pvps ofc not, but thats not the point atm i guess, if u cannot stun someone, there is not big chance to burst him down, and on the other hand i believe that tyrant can go straight to u and 2-3 shot u and doesnt give a **** about debuffs at that moment

ofc it depends on situation if u need to use debuffs or not, but saying some classes are not dependant on debuffs is sh1t imo

also from our server, i dont see ppl using debuffs as heavily as on rus/eu off videos, where u can see everyone running with 5 debuffs

​With adding Mj sets y will forget about stun on archer anyway and dont forget about 3 proff buffs and runes which will boost your critical and atack speed as well..... 

I guess archers depend on debuffs about 10% not more, on GK it probably took 4-5 mounth( maybe more dunno ) here it wil take much less I guess about 2-3 and about tyrant believe me he can rush and give GIGANTIC amount of dmg for sure but after this he ends CD on skills, and he can support for next 5-4 sec only with stuns cripple etc. 

[Dancerok 21]

Take for example 

Stun Blast

1

debuff

53

507

7200000

500

-

Creates a powerful shock wave with 2486 Power, inflicting damage and stunning the target and nearby enemies for 7 seconds. Decreases their P. Def. by 30% and M. Def. by 30%. Requires a polearm. Over-hit and Critical are possible. Ignores Shield Defense. Target cancel is possible.

 

Take this for example it means allot for WL in pt and this song take this skill and shove it y know where  

 

[MoDoy 1769]

​How y will get know that party has this song? besides if they rush on y y can't kite it for sure...

What to do classes that 90% depends from debuffs? Instantly die. At least to do reuse time longer not 2 min song duration and 1 more min reuse time 

​not every song/dance have same animation, so if they s/d on your sight, some member can see them using it and take advantage of it to kite at least some time of it, ofc its not always possible

thats why sometimes diversity for pt is better, not having full burst dmg setup on DDs but some crowd controler as well, also its not good to have whole cp being crowd controlers but have something with good dps, also if your whole cp depends on landing debuffs, then u arent competitive if u arent on same lvl as those high lvl enemies, and then u should have song of purification as well, once they have it

​It's not only about dmg the game is build in the way that some classes depends on debuffs on 90% some on 50 while other dont need it at all, for example archers cp doesnt care about this song they are mostly auto hit while Warlords, Gladis, Destros, Tyrants even Daggers  depends on debuffs ( some 50% some 20%  depends ). I just want to underline that with this buff implementation everyone will start reroll to archer or mages soon...

​sorry, but i want to disagree with your statemenet, on our server archers do depend on debuffs in case of pt vs pt or 18vs18, on mass pvps ofc not, but thats not the point atm i guess, if u cannot stun someone, there is not big chance to burst him down, and on the other hand i believe that tyrant can go straight to u and 2-3 shot u and doesnt give a **** about debuffs at that moment

ofc it depends on situation if u need to use debuffs or not, but saying some classes are not dependant on debuffs is sh1t imo

also from our server, i dont see ppl using debuffs as heavily as on rus/eu off videos, where u can see everyone running with 5 debuffs

​With adding Mj sets y will forget about stun on archer anyway and dont forget about 3 proff buffs and runes which will boost your critical and atack speed as well..... 

I guess archers depend on debuffs about 10% not more, on GK it probably took 4-5 mounth( maybe more dunno ) here it wil take much less I guess about 2-3 and about tyrant believe me he can rush and give GIGANTIC amount of dmg for sure but after this he ends CD on skills, and he can support for next 5-4 sec only with stuns cripple etc. 

​show me 1 active tyrant on server who is actively using cripple, i would dare u  also mj on ppl? there is no way ppl will make those in 2 months from what i heard, when rift of heaven will be same as on official (from staff i heard eventho they want to add some things to make A equip also in different way, they dont intend to change unsealing things, which is major problem in making A sets

Take for example 

Stun Blast

1

debuff

53

507

7200000

500

-

Creates a powerful shock wave with 2486 Power, inflicting damage and stunning the target and nearby enemies for 7 seconds. Decreases their P. Def. by 30% and M. Def. by 30%. Requires a polearm. Over-hit and Critical are possible. Ignores Shield Defense. Target cancel is possible.

 

Take this for example it means allot for WL in pt and this song take this skill and shove it y know where  

 

​yes, atm there is no real counter vs warlord (even with RS its over 90% https://4gameforum.com/threads/574500/ ),while wl gets 1 more range stun, 1 range skill to remove ww and 1 range skill to root someone for 8-10 sec, kinda op as well right? there should be way how to counter it? yep, thats where song of purification kicks in, one class cannot stay op everytime, but they change once u lvl up/get other skills/get some special equip

also thats why u shouldnt have 4 WLs in your pt, but some tyrant or gladi for burst dmg when those debuffs cannot land

[Pepon 90]

Why do u take over my whining post to whine about other matters ?

[Arcanum 312]

something bothered me about dyes and stats overall, so i went to check for infos again.

this is what i've found on offi wiki: https://l2wiki.com/classic/Tattoo

Stat	Impact
STR	P. Atk., P. Critical Damage
DEX	P. Critical Rate, P. Accuracy, P. Evasion, Atk. Spd.
CON	Max.HP, HP Recovery Bonus, Max.СР, Weight Limit, Breath Limit, underwater НР decrease, shield defense rate, Resistance to debuff attacks (stun, poison, bleeding)
INT	M. Atk., M. Critical
WIT	M. Critical Rate, M. Accuracy, M. Evasion, Casting Spd., Magic Resistance, HP restoration when resurrected.
(MEN)	Magic Resistance, Max.МР, МР restoration Spd, magic cancel rate, increases status resistance (debuffs, madness (Fear, Silence), paralysis, НР decrease, МР decrease magic, НР recovery decrease, skill usage timeout increase, recovery speed decrease)

 

considering that the stuff written there about CON and stun is wrong, at this point i wonder if even MEN works at all against debuffs or not.

if those infos are not reliable because partially wrong(wich is very bad, considering they're from offi source), the only way to find out what works or not is by doing tests. 

i believe that some tests were done already on offi regarding CON not affecting stun land rate, althou i haven't seen anything regarding MEN helping to resist magical debuffs.

i know it's something minor at the moment, but it might explain why some magic skills have different land rates compared to others. custom nerfs excluded, of course.

[Rizos 1487]

Its all wrong str doesnt give crit dmg, int doesnt give m crit, con doesnt gice stun resist, men PROBABLY doesnt give resist debuf

[Cyane 230]

Stats have influence on debuff resistance in our server (except anchor, so maybe LS is not affected either) ll ask San0 to check it

[Arcanum 312]

Stats have influence on debuff resistance in our server (except anchor, so maybe LS is not affected either) ll ask San0 to check it

​now i'm even more confused than before.

so you mean that in our server currently every stat has influence over every debuff depending on stats type?(example: stun over CON)

'cause as far as i remember, it was based only on levels at first, then it got changed to levels + skill chance, and now i have no idea how they're currently working here.

[Cyane 230]

Stats have influence on debuff resistance in our server (except anchor, so maybe LS is not affected either) ll ask San0 to check it

​now i'm even more confused than before.

so you mean that in our server currently every stat has influence over every debuff depending on stats type?(example: stun over CON)

'cause as far as i remember, it was based only on levels at first, then it got changed to levels + skill chance, and now i have no idea how they're currently working here.

From what i tested in 1.5 test sv stats influence debuff resistance, im sure of it. But lvl difference is much more important

[Cyane 230]

@San0 pls check debuff resistance off tyrant stun against target of same lvl but with 99 con. According to Official there is no difference, but here, target becomes practically inmune to it

[Rizos 1487]

 

Cyane-W zeszły wtorek o 20:45

 

@San0 could you test in some free time on test server if con affects stun resistance? it would be usefull to know

 

 

thks

 

 

San0-W zeszły wtorek o 21:51

 

im almost sure it doesnt. i remember testing it with koll long time ago with 1 and then with 99 and was same i think.

[MoDoy 1769]

 

Cyane-W zeszły wtorek o 20:45

 

@San0 could you test in some free time on test server if con affects stun resistance? it would be usefull to know

 

 

thks

 

 

San0-W zeszły wtorek o 21:51

 

im almost sure it doesnt. i remember testing it with koll long time ago with 1 and then with 99 and was same i think.

"no more info about testing on discord, u noobs are spoiling everything" - san0 2k17 (inc. soon)  

[Arcanum 312]

@San0 pls check debuff resistance off tyrant stun against target of same lvl but with 99 con. According to Official there is no difference, but here, target becomes practically inmune to it

​i'm not sure how i feel about this.

having the old formulas based on stats for debuffs resist may open new builds for PvP/oly, but that way it wouldn't be as classic anymore.

may also explain why tanks going full +12 CON are not getting stunned too much, or perhaps it's just luck with resist shock.

[Kure 444]

 

- Fixed Lightning strike land rate.

 

Lets check it..