[WEIGHT IN]Class change service update ideas.

[San0 2419]

with the lunch of the update we have been receiving many questions of when we plan to update the class change system or if we plan on doing it and what we plan to change and so on, both from players who want to come back and have their chars with some random class and dont want to relevel again from start, or from players still here that at some point changed some char to other class and now cant go back or that are already too high lvl and too invested on their chars to loose something from it.

as so i would like to know from you guys what kind of things you would like to see there, in your point of view how can we improve it in a way to please most of the people and keep the service balanced and useful as it has been till now.

please no troll posts. spam will be deleted, flames to eachothers will be deleted, serious business here.

[Anytime 556]

• set up lvl to 79
• no classchange quest for 3rd class needed (if old class did it already)
• maybe replace books if they had 3rd class skills on char before
• increase price for classchange a bit cauz it will be more work for you! (with books and stuff)
• maybe rework groups a bit!
• make something like cooldown! so you cant switch like there is no tomorrow!

Makes the rules soft. Class-Service was always a very great service wich keeps server and cps alive!

I know its pussy-style but i love this service so much! Its just great.

Edited October 18, 2019 by Anytime

[Humble 115]

Dont change it.

Edited October 18, 2019 by Humble

[MoDoy 1772]

for any1 who wants to read current status, here is link to service https://l2classic.club/forum/topic/7439-class-change/

 

- make it safe to lvl up up to 78 lvl (right now its up to 77 (now you get deleveled to 76 100%, make it 77 100%)
- i dont think compensation for 3rd class skills is needed, now with olympiad chests the books arent that expensive anymore
- as anytime said, if its 3rd class already, then make it 3rd class without having to repeat quest
- considering changing tiers a bit, maybe i would put ES to the 4th tier group and spellsinger/sorcerer/gladiator to 3rd tier group, BD/SWS i would put into 1st tier group and rest of the 2nd tier group i would just merge with 3rd tier (tanks+dwarves), so that would leave us with 3 tiers only instead of 4

important note: i would actually make some special DA tier group, its solo lvling is superb on very basic buffs because of panther which would put him probably in tier 4, however putting DA into tier 4 would just result into everyone class changing their not important boxes into DAs as oly farmers, which is terrible idea i would say as olympiad already looks terrible when you look at it, so i would just say that DA would go into 4th tier and same like at dwarves case, it would have just (only to change from it) - maybe would be worth looking if same thing wouldnt be nice to implement for ES as well, to just be able to class change from it to something else 

so in the end, it would look something like this:

First group classes:
Overlord
Prophet
Warcryer
Bishop
Elven Elder
Shillien Elder
Bladedancer
Swordsinger

Second group classes:
Warsmith (only to change from it)
Bounty Hunter (only to change from it)
Paladin
Temple Knight
Shillien Knight
Treasure Hunter
Hawkeye
Plainswalker
Silver Ranger
Abyss Walker
Warlock
Phantom Summoner
Spellsinger
Sorcerer
Gladiator

Third group classes:
Destroyer
Tyrant
Warlord
Elemental Summoner (only to change from it)
Phantom Ranger
Spellhowler
Necromancer
Dark Avenger (only to change from it)

Edited October 18, 2019 by MoDoy

[SemenArsonist 568]

Another idea would be to make exceptions for classes that need more representation ingame. Like maybe tks, paladins, bladedancers, shit like this. Make it like an event or something. For example during a span of one week, class changes will be accepted for 4th category classes (like phantom ranger) to reroll to some 2nd category classes (the ones you actually want to see more ingame, not every 2nd category classes). I don't know really, it could be a bad idea too, just throwing some ideas for you guys to consider.

Edited October 18, 2019 by SemenArsonist

[MoDoy 1772]

Just now, SemenArsonist said:

Another idea would be to make exceptions for classes that need more representation ingame. Like maybe tks, paladins, bladedancers, shit like this. Make it like an event or something. For example during a span of one week, class changes will be accepted for 4th category classes (like phantom ranger) to reroll to some 2nd category classes (the ones you actually want to see more ingame, not every 2nd category classes. I don't know really, it could be a bad idea too, just throwing some ideas for you guys to consider.

thats interesting idea, tho i wonder how that would work, how often that would happen and stuff. Tried to solve this with reducing 4 tiers into 3 tiers, while 2nd tier having lots of options when their solo pve is far inferior to classes from 3rd tier.

that would in common sense increase occurance of tanks (as their tier increased and now even from pleb DDs you could reroll to them (except DA), but one would say it would even reduce occurance of pleb mages for example like sps/sorcerer, as their tier dropped and even less classes can class change to them -> i would say thats not exactly true, because now people might consider changing to sps/sorcerer with knowing they wont be doomed into last 4th tier, but if they dont like it or it will be like super weak, they have more options to class change than before

[Werew 74]

No xp loss till 78 any change for 79 + should take you back to 78 and 99% 

Only buff slot books should be restored  any other 3rd skills should not ( they are way to cheap now to bother)

 

[Anytime 556]

5 minutes ago, SemenArsonist said:

Another idea would be to make exceptions for classes that need more representation ingame. Like maybe tks, paladins, bladedancers, shit like this. Make it like an event or something. For example during a span of one week, class changes will be accepted for 4th category classes (like phantom ranger) to reroll to some 2nd category classes (the ones you actually want to see more ingame, not every 2nd category classes). I don't know really, it could be a bad idea too, just throwing some ideas for you guys to consider.

hmm dunno. But change PR to TK dosent sound fair. And then he change back after a while for some other class.

Edited October 18, 2019 by Anytime

[Anytime 556]

2 minutes ago, Werew said:

No xp loss till 78 any change for 79 + should take you back to 78 and 99% 

Only buff slot books should be restored  any other 3rd skills should not ( they are way to cheap now to bother)

 

ye .. that buffslot stuff sounds legit! good idear!

[Donkihot 114]

1 hour ago, MoDoy said:

...

Second group classes:
.Spellsinger
Sorcerer
Third group classes:

Spellhowler
Necromancer
 

@MoDoy, so it will make things even worse? Tyrants/destro wont be able to change to SPS/Sorc, only sph/necro. And as far as we know, sph and necro top mages, so I would change places,if someone wants to play OP mage go play him from the begginng, but if u choosed pve machine, choose sorc or sps

[Donkihot 114]

10 minutes ago, Anytime said:

cauz they dont have cdl? and lowest base dmg?

my point is, if u move sps and sorc out of 4th group, even less ppl gonna play them and more and more sph/necro will be around.

edit: (to avoid spam)

I think what we have right now- balanced, don't change anything.

Edited October 18, 2019 by Donkihot

[Werew 74]

I don't disagree with this, you can put them in first group by me  I don't see what harm can do if tomorrow we see 100 more sorcs and sps running around 

[Naoki 3]

 

78 or + do not return to 76 99% and yes to 77 99% and without losing book sloot buff.

[Rizos 1487]

Make only 2 tiers as most ppl can exp on rbs now so class doesnt matter much and lvling is fast

- Support tier

- DD tier

Let ppl get back to their oryginal class, they had before tiers changes

- make ppl keep 3rd class after class change

- ignore 3rd class books, but give back buff slot books(like untill now)

- make max lvl 78 100%

 

If ppl "abuse" and exp pr to change it to sps, who cares. U can exp any class to 76 in 1 month now, atleast server gets profit and no1 gonna care if some new commer made 76 in 1 month instead of 2 months

Edited October 18, 2019 by Rizos

[Poseidon 452]

36 minutes ago, Rizos said:

Make only 2 tiers as most ppl can exp on rbs now so class doesnt matter much and lvling is fast

- Support tier

- DD tier

Let ppl get back to their oryginal class, they had before tiers changes

- make ppl keep 3rd class after class change

- ignore 3rd class books, but give back buff slot books(like untill now)

- make max lvl 78 100%

 

If ppl "abuse" and exp pr to change it to sps, who cares. U can exp any class to 76 in 1 month now, atleast server gets profit and no1 gonna care if some new commer made 76 in 1 month instead of 2 months

good idea if you want to make a x100k pvp server, thanks, but no

[Poseidon 452]

3 hours ago, San0 said:

with the lunch of the update we have been receiving many questions of when we plan to update the class change system or if we plan on doing it and what we plan to change and so on, both from players who want to come back and have their chars with some random class and dont want to relevel again from start, or from players still here that at some point changed some char to other class and now cant go back or that are already too high lvl and too invested on their chars to loose something from it.

as so i would like to know from you guys what kind of things you would like to see there, in your point of view how can we improve it in a way to please most of the people and keep the service balanced and useful as it has been till now.

please no troll posts. spam will be deleted, flames to eachothers will be deleted, serious business here.

if too many of them will come back after reworked class change system, then rise the payment to some real cost, or make really big level reduction after class change, otherwise no point to change anything, imho

Edited October 18, 2019 by Poseidon

[FryderykChopin 853]

Well, obviously the groups need to be changed, I've had different idea in my mind but I liked modoyki's reasoning so I'd sign myself under his list as well. 

btw @San0 would it be possible to make process automatic so you wouldn't have to manually change it yourself to reduce the waiting time?

[San0 2419]

10 minutes ago, FryderykChopin said:

Well, obviously the groups need to be changed, I've had different idea in my mind but I liked modoyki's reasoning so I'd sign myself under his list as well. 

btw @San0 would it be possible to make process automatic so you wouldn't have to manually change it yourself to reduce the waiting time?

to provide it properly as we do now with SP refunds and so on no. otherwise it would have been done already.

[Cyane 230]

If raid bosses are the fastest and most usual way to lvl up, then Sps, wl and sorc are the most affected and shouldnt be in the last tier. They arent efficient for single mob killing and they are less(never) chosen for rb pts. If they are not balanced with new skills from newer classic patches, they should be considered here

[MoDoy 1772]

5 minutes ago, Cyane said:

If raid bosses are the fastest and most usual way to lvl up, then Sps, wl and sorc are the most affected and shouldnt be in the last tier. They arent efficient for single mob killing and they are less(never) chosen for rb pts. If they are not balanced with new skills from newer classic patches, they should be considered here

i have put WL to last tier coz of his solo lvling potential with EE, but considering his powerlevel in this patch, i would be up to putting him in the middle tier as well together with sorc+sps

[Rizos 1487]

5 hours ago, Poseidon said:

if too many of them will come back after reworked class change system, then rise the payment to some real cost, or make really big level reduction after class change, otherwise no point to change anything, imho

yes, dont let ppl class change so they dont come back, or make price higher than they can afford. Who needs players on the server. U can get more mobs for urself.

I dont see big abusement if u actually make 2 tiers. Ok u can make lvl after class change lower, if ur afraid of abuse. U can make ppl delvl for 76 0 % and 3rd class but make 2 tiers. The more tiers u make the more u limit class change for ppl and give less options so in the end less ppl come back etc. 

Edited October 18, 2019 by Rizos

[Poseidon 452]

57 minutes ago, Rizos said:

yes, dont let ppl class change so they dont come back, or make price higher than they can afford. Who needs players on the server. U can get more mobs for urself.

I dont see big abusement if u actually make 2 tiers. Ok u can make lvl after class change lower, if ur afraid of abuse. U can make ppl delvl for 76 0 % and 3rd class but make 2 tiers. The more tiers u make the more u limit class change for ppl and give less options so in the end less ppl come back etc. 

no you dont understand, lets solove problems of all kids, so they could jump from class to class like on pvp server. class change is good as it is right now, i dont see any problems of those "who can't return", moreover you can reach 70+ in a short period of time

[shinobisan 5]

I think class change tiers the we have now are fine, no need to change that.

The issue is with people who want a class tier that is above his current class tier.

My idea is: allow people to go back only one tier back at a time and with following conditions:

1) current char needs to be lvl 80
2) lvl afer change: 74 100%
3) no materials invested returned (books, etc)
4) maybe make it limited event (2-3 months?).

this is just an idea, conditions can vary, but it shouldn't be free to change class to a tier above current one.

Personally I think you should start a char from 0, but I understand it is for the good of the server.

[Duvs 40]

14 hours ago, MoDoy said:

for any1 who wants to read current status, here is link to service https://l2classic.club/forum/topic/7439-class-change/

 

- make it safe to lvl up up to 78 lvl (right now its up to 77 (now you get deleveled to 76 100%, make it 77 100%)
- i dont think compensation for 3rd class skills is needed, now with olympiad chests the books arent that expensive anymore
- as anytime said, if its 3rd class already, then make it 3rd class without having to repeat quest
- considering changing tiers a bit, maybe i would put ES to the 4th tier group and spellsinger/sorcerer/gladiator to 3rd tier group, BD/SWS i would put into 1st tier group and rest of the 2nd tier group i would just merge with 3rd tier (tanks+dwarves), so that would leave us with 3 tiers only instead of 4

important note: i would actually make some special DA tier group, its solo lvling is superb on very basic buffs because of panther which would put him probably in tier 4, however putting DA into tier 4 would just result into everyone class changing their not important boxes into DAs as oly farmers, which is terrible idea i would say as olympiad already looks terrible when you look at it, so i would just say that DA would go into 4th tier and same like at dwarves case, it would have just (only to change from it) - maybe would be worth looking if same thing wouldnt be nice to implement for ES as well, to just be able to class change from it to something else 

so in the end, it would look something like this:

First group classes:
Overlord
Prophet
Warcryer
Bishop
Elven Elder
Shillien Elder
Bladedancer
Swordsinger

Second group classes:
Warsmith (only to change from it)
Bounty Hunter (only to change from it)
Paladin
Temple Knight
Shillien Knight
Treasure Hunter
Hawkeye
Plainswalker
Silver Ranger
Abyss Walker
Warlock
Phantom Summoner
Spellsinger
Sorcerer
Gladiator

Third group classes:
Destroyer
Tyrant
Warlord
Elemental Summoner (only to change from it)
Phantom Ranger
Spellhowler
Necromancer
Dark Avenger (only to change from it)

First group classes:
Overlord (only to change from it)
Prophet
Warcryer
Bishop (only to change from it)
Elven Elder
Shillien Elder
Bladedancer
Swordsinger

Second group classes:
Warsmith (only to change from it)
Bounty Hunter (only to change from it)
Paladin
Temple Knight
Shillien Knight
Treasure Hunter
Hawkeye
Plainswalker
Silver Ranger
Abyss Walker
Warlock
Phantom Summoner
Spellsinger
Sorcerer
Gladiator

Third group classes:
Destroyer
Tyrant
Warlord
Elemental Summoner (only to change from it)
Phantom Ranger
Spellhowler
Necromancer
Dark Avenger (only to change from it)

I believe that there are unique classes that should not fall under reroll. This will better.

[Reddish 258]

This is a must

DA must be rectricted class, or changed Fear skill behaviour. 
Reason: U go oly any other class than DA - u loose them 99% (1% is that he gets DC for some godly reasons).

This is vital

Also changing must have a flexible prices, depending on lvl:

• 55-60 - 5 Eur
• 61-70 - 10 Eur
• 71-75 - 20 Eur
• 76-78 - 40 Eur
• 79 +   - 60 Eur

Reason: Prices are taken regarding black market, we all know there is one. So if administration want to got more competiteve - this is the way.

This to be considered

If character (not the account, cuz it can be swapped) was ever banned for botting - price for changing class doubles, or triples.
Reason: we all know there was and there are, and they still will be botting business for exping characters and selling them, if they make money on this server, GMs must at least take a piece of this pie.

Class change also provide all the skills learnt till 3rd class, 3rd class skills must be compensated with only one set of MTs (31), so at least one skill u crave for may be learned.
Reason: different classes have different skills, so it is much more easier to give a little choice to ppl who buy this service, also this will a plus for those who choose to reroll, or buy character.

Edit: If you think it's bad to use this service as an option to earn money - don't.
I want to play here long and thankful GMs for they position and principles they are using while running the true classic spirit here, and any small income which won't brake the game itself is a good additional motivation to keep server going. 
 

Edited October 19, 2019 by Reddish